But ...
I was just thinking about the favorite explanation of some, that profound treasures are placed at the bottom of dungeons, "to protect them." Adventuring players must then battle their way through a host of rooms to reach the fabled treasure, that usually turns out to be a profound magical item, or group of items, laying atop a big pile of treasure.
Only, I wonder if any player has ever felt, after getting this item, artefact or whatever, a great need to build a dungeon and fill it with monsters to "protect" this item they've just obtained. I think not. Players seem to prefer keeping the items with them, and employing them, flagrantly carrying them along roads and through towns, casually hanging out in taverns with the items in their pocket or hanging on their belts, while spending the treasure on things rather than keeping it in an enormous pile in an isolated place.
So where does this motivation come from that NPCs, having acquired the treasure themselves, and the items, feel such compulsion to sequester such things so far from themselves that when the plunderers break in, the NPCs don't even know the item is gone? Hm? Surely, the last room, with all the treasure, should include a magic mouth or something that suddenly shouts, "Oh, so you've found my treasure, that I was keeping here for a week or two while visiting my mother. Well, I've just cast clairvoyance and clairaudience, so put everything down if you don't want me to kill you in a day or two. And I'll thank you to round up a bunch of golems, ghouls, kelpies, crayfish and sphinx to repopulate my dungeon. Thank you, have a nice day."
Just saying.
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| Why is it we never find one of these enormous, underground civilizations while they're still active? |
Crayfish? I'm on my way to that dungeon with a pot of boiling water thank you very much.
ReplyDeleteWell, if Archwizard Mogor the Wise decided to hide that magic item two hundred meters underground, in a monster infested mine, there must be a sound reason.
ReplyDeleteI honestly always hated all the adventures where humanoids have magic items thrown about their living space, without actually using them. Even a dumb person would realize the value of a sword that is incredibly sharp and never dents or rust. Maybe they won't understand that it's magic, or that it can emit flames with a command word... but this wont stop them from using it to hack people to death.
It gets even worse with intelligent weapons that were somewhat common in older editions. They would totally use their ego to convince anyone to pick them up (like the one ring) to achieve their purpose. It's unthinkable that they would forever sit, lost in the depths of a (populated) dungeon.
I think the dungeon is presented like that only to justify the killing of its inhabitants and looting of the items (they don't deserve). We are just killing the evil, irredeemable, stupid guys - so much they can't ever be considered people.
After all, if I were to kill the local sheriff for his magic sword and ring, wouldn't I be considered a murderer and sociopath? That wouldn't be very much heroic or adventurous, would it?
There is one system where dungeons are built to house monsters so that they may be harvested for spell components/material for magic item creation, and the treasure is placed there to lure them. The reason that the best stuff was at the bottom of dungeons then was that the most powerful creatures preferred it down there, and brought the best stuff with them from the hoard.
ReplyDeleteI've always liked the idea that magic items were less purpose built and more "grown", where they would be tucked away and accumulate power over time. This makes people think that magic was stronger in the past, when in fact it's simply that it takes thousands of years for a sword to develop a +5 enchantment at all!
So, Pandred. A group of PLAYER CHARACTERS decide to build such a dungeon, because the 20th level mage needs those spell components. And after gathering the creatures together, and sorting them out into their rooms and spaces, OF COURSE the party simply abandons the place, posts no guards, does not put up warning signs, "Hey, this is a highly dangerous and massively patrolled spell use farm owned by an insanely high level mage! Keep out! And hey, the local King is the mage's BFF."
ReplyDeleteNo, in fact, the entranceway is very cryptic and hidden, there are no signs at all that any of this is OWNED by anyone, the party puts in a few traps but nothing that will actually kill 4th-12th level interlopers, plus, of course, PUZZLES, because the mage likes to have guests in and he likes party games.
Is no one going to address the point that Player Characters would Never, Ever, Ever do this? Jeez, just consider what a pain in the ass it would be to set up the place, much less maintain it and keep the beholder from simply eating everything.
Mmm. My thought is that adventurers DIE in dungeons, leaving their equipment behind (undigested...unlike their corpses). More experienced adventurers with more powerful items can make it into deeper and more dangerous territory before having their luck run out...hence more powerful items are found on lower levels.
ReplyDeleteI’ve rarely considered items having been purposefully sequestered away from prying eyes...unless you’re talking about an actual treasure vault (examples being found in, say, Hall of the Fire Giant King or The Lost Caverns of Tsojcanth).
I'm not sure if you read my recent post on my blog where I criticize a YouTuber for saying dungeons are stupid or not, but this post seems similar to it. The YouTuber was of the opinion that most dungeons should be the place where the BBEG keeps all his stuff. I disagree. And with regards to your point here, so does history.
ReplyDeleteMost royal treasuries, from my limited historical knowledge of the subject, were not secreted away in underground vaults guarded by traps and soldiers day and night.
And most secreted underground treasure hoards were not "someone's stuff." At least, not the stuff of anyone still alive. The treasures were grave goods interred with some king or other dignitary. Or were lost or buried in some natural disaster.
For most dungeons, the monsters really shouldn't have been placed specifically as guardians. The treasure was there, and the monsters decided that was a good place to move in after the people who buried the treasure there (or lost it) moved on.
Of course, why all the traps? That's still only logical in tombs, as they would be installed to deter grave robbers. In a lost city that was buried by an earthquake or swallowed by the sea but later belched back out again, all the traps don't really make sense.
Yes, why all the traps?
ReplyDeleteI've had player characters set up lairs for themselves. They do not fill these lairs with traps. Why do the monsters?