I do have a post for what happens after entering the dungeon, but first ...
Would anyone like the comment on the absurdity of including this in a book for dungeons and dragons?
It's taken me some time to realise that part of the reason people aren't more inventive with dungeons or outdoor settings is that most people don't actually know anything. Until researching the above, I didn't know most of this about marmalade. I know what it tastes like. I didn't know it came from quinces, I didn't know it was as old as the Romans and I certainly didn't know about the development of the mixture. Since I'm the sort that usually knows about things, I feel safe guessing that the above is new to most of you.
There are a few things in the above that have D&D applications, at least as description fluff. The mage can have a garden full of quince trees, the innkeeper might be brewing honey in the back yard to make next years marmalade supply. Really expensive marmalade can be used as a sort of treasure, as anything made of boiled honey keeps for a long time. I have a container of honey in my non-refridgerated pantry that's been there for two years. Still good. But ... I live in a cold country.
It's larger that this, though, because marmalade's not the only thing on this very large list. There are four complete pages on confections, odd beverages and condiments, together suggesting a complicated state of affairs that gives some sense of what cities and towns are really like. It's not just people buying and selling, there are hundreds who are fixated on the manufacture of substances that won't keep long, that must be rushed out to inns and ornate houses in time to appear on someone's dinner table. This puts something on the carts being pushed around, or the boxes being carried, that can be tripped over by thieves or smelled as the players step out the inn's door. All this adds tactile sensory detail to the game world that gives dimension ... but if it never occurs to the DM that none of this is going on, because the only things that seem to exist in the world are a few animals and bits of equipment that adventurer's might need, then city life is rather stale, all round.
Which is what I mean when I say that a lot of DMs, including both adults and children, have simply never had cause to search for far-reaching and elaborate details that could be used to describe the game world. I believe that the overall collection of things, things of every kind, might insidiously fetch themselves into the DM's thoughts, so that suddenly all sorts of fascinating things emerge inside dungeons or along the roads, or on a tavern's eating bench. I mean, things other than beer.
Wonderful.
ReplyDeleteThe real world is so full and detailed; we literally have an infinite well of inspiration to draw from.
Doesn't look like anyone here thinks it's absurd at all. I certainly don't.
ReplyDeleteI'm writing the book and I think it's absurd.
ReplyDeleteIt's not anything like the perception of D&D that I had 20 years ago. Perhaps that's it.
Every detail you share makes the book that much more tantalizing to me, I can't wait to have the thing in my hands. This is the sort of dnd material I find useful; yes, I can research this stuff or anything else(like historical culture or whatnot) on my own, but works like this where the research has already been done and is accurate and distills what might be useful in a game world is exactly what I look for in a game product. And sadly most of the stuff I get has only tidbits of this sort of thing, which is enough for me to get just for those little tidbits. So your work is many magnitudes higher on my list of something I want.
ReplyDeleteI loved the 5 pages you put on Patreon, lovely stuff and indeed opening avenues of thoughts I didn't know were there.
ReplyDeleteThe world is becoming a more interesting place ...
Imay be a bit late, but if you haven't checked it out yet, I would recommand Charles de la Roncières's "Prix et salaires à Florence au XIVe siècle (1280-1380)"(1982) which is a classic work of quantitative history. According to an historian friend, it should be quoted in every serious piece about medieval prices -- as a way to rectify the England-centric bias that plagues most articles on the subject in the anglophone web.
ReplyDeleteYou can find a 2016 reprint for 20 euros in french online bookshops. It doesn't seem to be on Amazon though. The library of the University of British Columbia lists it as available.
Thank you, ViP.
ReplyDeleteI think the absurdity depends on the goal of your running. Are you going into dungeons to kill monsters and take their stuff? Or are you trying to emulate an actual world that people live in? Both are "D&D" according to my definition, and for the former this is definitely absurd, but for the latter it is useful.
ReplyDeleteRe: Knowing things - I've been reading/studying Ancient Rome for over 20 years. I've read recipes for garum, soldier's hardtack, methods of beer and wine making, food preservation, delicacies... I had no idea they came up with marmalade.
Funny you should mention garum ...
ReplyDeleteI don't see the the absurdity. I would argue that this kind of information is the *only* one a self-respecting DM would pay for. All the fluff thats pollutes usual sourcebooks regarding pantheons or politics or social strata or the colour of Elminster's pants, can and should be drawn from your readings, experience et previous researches, or just made up. The time and cost involved in building a small fort, having a manuscript copied or acquiring an amphora of olive oil, or for that matter a jar of medieval marmelade, just cannot be estimated on the fly.
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